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led to the establishment of the college at servation to be satisfied, that the opposition Hertford. It was first set up by the East and objections of many individuals, in India Company; and in 1813 made a some way or other connected with the Com. College, by an Act of Parliament, espe pany, naturally arose upon their finding cially confirming the foundation and its their patronage thus encroached upon. statutes, and authorizing a variety of regu. But, again, a certificate of morals was now lations as to its future government and exacted, and such a certificate was not arrangements. First, there was a certifi- formerly required. So that here a man's cate required, to be delivered by the Pro- hopes and destinies might suddenly sink fessor in the school to which the young under him, because he possessed no certifiman who was going out to Ind belonged; cate of his moral conduct: and for his next, a certain course of studies was en. own part, he did not mean to say that the joined, a course of which he (the Hon. thing should not be so; because the EastProprietor) would say, if he might be India Company ought certainly not to send permitted to indulge an opinion on the sub out young men, not qualified in point of ject, he hoped that the Court, by its deci- morals to fill situations in India, upon sion this day, would render perpetual. the proper and efficient discharge of which (Hear, hear!)

. In addition to this, a cer depended the welfare and the happiness of tificate was required to be given, on the 60,000,000 of people. No wonder, howgoing out of the party, by the Professor, ever, that a feeling of dissatisfaction relative to good conduct and proficiency in should quickly find its way from the paoriental languages (and these were to be rent to the child. The young men were such as the Court had been to-day informed given to understand that now, to qualify were necessary under the statutes), and for an appointment in India, was a very other matters. For all this extensive sys onerous business ; but, as had been well obtem of education, the young man, or his served by the Hon. Proprietor (Mr. D. parents, were to pay only 100 guineas per Kinnaird), it was to be remembered, that

Now he had not heard any grave young men were not always permitted to objection taken to the expense. What, then, choose their own employments in life. was the ground of so much objection to the There might be cases (not known, indeed, College? for all who objected might not to the individual who was addressing the take precisely the same view of the case Court) in which young men, dreading with the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Kinnaird). either the length of the voyage, or sickness, Why it was not to be expected that a col or the heat of the climate, might decline lege of this kind, seeing how much and India altogether, and prefer staying at how immediately it interfered with patror.. home: and this was all very well. Perage (hear, hear!) should not, even at the haps, in a like situation, he might do so outset, excite considerable enmity and op himself. But all this bad produced consiposition. Before the passing of this Actderable dissatisfaction in certain quarters ; of Parliament, any young lad of fifteen and it was impossible to say, that the same years of age who had the requisite in. sort of feeling might not occasion a good terest, although he had acquired no other deal of excitement among the young genknowledge but the mere rudiments of the tlemen themselves. Notwithstanding this, meanest education, such as spelling, read he must presume to say, upon the question ing, writing, and arithmetic (which might of qualification, that the statute having all of them be picked up by a lad in any laid down certain definite and invariable of the commonest writing schools in the principles, and seeing also how well the country), might go out to India.

system of qualification at our universities now required that he should be compe had answered in this country, he did not tently skilled in arithmetic, Latin, and know why it should not be of equal benefit Greek. These were the qualifications re with respect to India. (Hear!) Mr. Mal. quired of him, even at his entrance into thus observed on this point : “ These the College, when he passed an examina means of exciting emulation and industry tion. The Court had already heard that, have been attended with great success. before be quitted the college, he was to Though there are some, unquestionably, be certified as having made the requisite or whom motives of this kind will not or progress in the oriental languages, mathe. cannot operate, and with whom, therefore, matics, theology, &c. Then, again, as to little can be done; yet a more than usual his period of service : the addition to that proportion seem to be animated by a strong period was, perhaps, another ground of ub desire, accompanied by corresponding ef jection. If a young man could not now forts, to make a progress in the various go out to India until he was eighteen years studies proposed to them. Those who of age, and before the establishment of have come to college tolerably good scbo. this college he could go out at fifteen, it lars, have often, during their stay of two required very little proficiency in arithme years, made such advances in the classical tic to discern, that three years were added department, as would have done them to the period in which he could hope to ac great credit, if they had devoted to it the quire a fortune.' It needed as little ob main part of their time ; while the conteni

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porary honours which they have obtained the whole of the writers destined for Benin other departments bave sufficiently gal must go to the College at Fort Wilproved, that their attention was not con liam, in Calcutta, which they entered, fined to one study; and many who had therefore, with the attainments that they come from public and private schools at bad made at Hertford College; and not sixteen, with such low classical attainments only did they manifest those attainments, as appeared to indicate a want either of but some of them, at their first entrance capacity or application, have shewn by into the College at Fort William, were their subsequent progress, even

in the able, not only to make a brilliant display classical department, and still mere by in the class of Oriental languages, and their distinguished exertions in others, that keep a very respectable rank upon the Cola new field, and new stimulants, had lege lists, but had actually abridged the wrought a most beneficial change in their average period of residence from three years feelings and habits, and had awakened to one-(Hear!) This was a striking energies, of which they were before scarcely exemplification of the utility of the Hertconscious. There are four or five of the ford institution, and these were facts Professors thoroughly conversant with which went far indeed to demonstrate the university examinations, who can take falsehood of many among the charges upon themselves to affirm, that they have brought against that establishment. It never witnessed a greater proportion of bad been said, that a youth was a boy, and various and successful exertion, in the not a man, at the age of sixteen; and it course of their academical experience, than was inferred that tlie objection taken to his has appeared at some of the examinations conduct, in some instances, arose out of at the East-India College."- Now, doubt. the early age at which he was sent to this less, the Hon. Proprietor (Mr. D. Kin- college; that some indiscretions were to naird) had not found this passage in the be expected in pupils, wlio, sent there at book he had quoted from; but there was the age of sixteen, were expected, the moanother upon the subject of morals in the ment they arrived there, to act like men. same bcok, which he would merely advert -(Hear, hear !) The answer to this was, to, for really he was ashamed of quoting. that the advantages of the regulation were Mr. Malthus insisted, not oniy that in this evident. The intermediate stage of life college there was not a deficiency of mo between youth and the commencement of rals - not only that its general moral cha manhood must be passed at Hertford Colracter was not lower than that of other lege, and certainly with more advantage colleges- but that, in this point, it was for than if the party were exposed, at such an the most part superior to the universities. age, to the temptations that abound in a This passage being as much to the point, warm climate. An exposure of that kind, and of as much importance as an; that Mr. indeed, would be to make them men someKinnaird bad quoted, he called the notice what prematurely: If he understood the of that Hon. Proprietor to it. Mr. Mal. Hon. Proprietors who were most opposed thus then proceeded, in his book, to call on to the present system, they tliought that those who in newspapers and other public parents or guardians, who could n ake the cations had libelled the institution, to conie fortunes of their sons or their wards in forward and endeatour to substantiate the India, ought rather, for a certain lapse of facts which they had put forth. Hitherto years, to send them to cither of the Univer. Mr. Malthus had been unsuccessful in his sities. If this proposition could in such appeal (a laugh), but in his book he adduced cases be acted upon, what advantage to the still stronger testimony than even this parties could come of it? The course of backwardness of the accusers. The Hon. an university education would occupy a Proprietor added, that he mentioned this

young man some years beyond the time at because the Court might expect to-day to which he ought to embark for the East; or hear something about the subject of morals. he would en bark for the East with a very With respect to insubordinations, it was unfinished and imperfect stock of knonadmitted that there liad been some in ledge, learning, and experience. And the College; and he should be glad to how would Hon. Gentlemen propose to know where it was not to be looked remedy this defect in these days, when it for in these times ? It was further was so difficult to get an university educastated by Mr. Malthus, that from one of tion? But the course of study in the Comour public seminaries there were more boys pany's College was infinitely better calcuexpelled at once-"uno iclu," as it were lated to fit the servants of the Company for ihan had been expelled from Heriford such appointments as they would have to College in seven years : let not gentle. fill, than the course either of Cambridge men therefore be run away with, at this or Oxford. In the universities they would time of day, by such a motion as that of be taught the dead languages, theology, the Hon. Proprietor, who surely could not and mathematics: in the College at Hertconvince their minds against such evidence ford they would learn, among other things, as this of Mr. Malthus. With regard to the principles of ethics; philosopliical the Oriental languages, the rule was, that science; history, ancient and modern, na

tional and universal; theology, and the How could the same measure give the construction of the Oriental languages. value of different capacities, and of difNow, unless gentlemen could define some ferent talents ? It was like measuring change in the period at which a parent different faiths, and about as impracticable. would allow his boy to go out to India, it Again he asked, how the saine measure or was impossible for them to devise any rule could be applied to the attainments of change for, the better in the Hertford sys men, who might have been brought up tem of education. A word or two, now, under different tutors, and instructed in as to the morals of universities. Far be it different sciences? To what degree could from him to derogate in any respect from one and the same standard ascertain the all that had been said about the morals of measurement of totally different articles those seminaries of sound learning and -fluids and solids, pulse and water? information; but would any man, would (Hear, hear !) It appeared to him, thereany father, who was acquainted with the fore, that there could be no such fixed, state of the streets at night in Oxford or definite, invariable test. But if there could Cambridge, and who knew the state of be, he wished to ask where the ultimate society in either university,—would any power of rejection was to reside? Was it man say but that the strects of Hertford meant to be said that the Directors should were the better of the two ?- that they pre be empowered to revoke the sentence of sented a much more favourable specimen of the Professors ? Ile put it to those Genmorality ?-(Hear, hear!) This was a tlemen themselves, to consider what ap. matter to which he adverted only by the plications, what intrigues there would be, way. But universities were proper to pre to induce them to look favourably on the pare for certain given stations in life manner in which young ge en susonly; they left ther, comparatively, little tained this test, and to recognize the merits fitted for others : and indeed there was a they had displayed. Was it, on the other freedom about their system, which sup hand, meant to be gravely proposed that posed that parties were afterwards to be the test should be left to be administered almost entirely independent of any other by the Directors? How were these imthan the ordinary restraints of society. portant questions to be answered? The He therefore considered that the broad la case was still worse, if the responsibility of titudinarian system of the universities was this test was to be put upon the tutor. Let adapted for England; but the system of it be observed, after all that had been said the college at Hertford, alone, for India. about the expulsions from Hertford, that Much had been said about tests and exa the Professors of that college were men minations which might be substituted in of probity, and of a high sense of duty; the place of the regulated course of this which they had evinced by standing their institution; and, before quitting this ground subsequenily to those expulsions, point, he might be allowed to advert although they had been exposed to all to what Lord Grenville had remarked sorts of entreaties, and of applications, upon the character of universities. of applications to their feelings. They His Lordsbip spoke very ably, and, in had been described as having ruined the deed, it was impossible for him to speak characters and blasted the expectations of on any subject otherwise than abiy, in fa these unfortunate youths; they had been vour of the advantages of an university edu assailed with representations and entreacation. It was not necessary to quote his ties; and, more than this, they had even words, for doubtless the Court would hear been menaced. (Hear!) The examiners of them in the further progress of this dis of the College had also been applied to. cussion ; but what his Lordsbip said ap Let the Court advert to the propositions plied only to men. No doubt of it; but of the Ilon. Proprietor who introduced was not the term during which this edu this motion, and see whether his examiners cation lasted to be taken into the account, would not be open to some applications of in estimating the preference to be given as that kind. If they were so open, such between the Universities and the Company's tests must nece sarily proceed in fraud; College? Gentlemen had said, that at the whereas (as was the case at Hertford) university there was a test by which can there ought to be a careful, scrupulous, didates for honours or degrees were tried; and professional duty, to be faithfully and that, in regard to those who desired to performed by those who had the charge of go out on civil appointments to India, a such examinat ons on their hands. Why similar test ought to be established; and then what became of the Hon. Proprietor's that if, upon examination, the man did not test ?-and that going, bis whole objection come up to this test, then let the whole and proposition went with it. (Hear!) matter as to him break down, and let him It was per se a test without measure and be dismissed: and this degree of com. without rule, and to which no certain repetency it was further proposed to open gulating principle could ever be applied. to general competition. But what was This part of the argument of that Hon. this test, and how was it to be applied ? Gentleman, he was entitled to say, sunk In what way was it to be administered ? down under its own inconsistency. But

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the Hon. Gentlemen had said, “Let the and let those who would not pursue the College continue to exist; I do not wish grert objects and interests of the Company, lo destroy it. I would not harm a hair of lay down their authority. Meanwhile, no its head. (A laugh.) But let us have private interests ought to intervene; but something else in its stead. Let us have their maxim should be another mode of educating these youths."

" Salus populi suprema ler." Now this was as bad in every respect as The state required that they should supthe doing away with the College : for port their College.

He could see no inwhere was the parent or guardian, who, justice in punishing a man for his miscog. with the cases of these youths before hin, duct; but it was said that it should not be could ever think of sending his son, or by expulsion. Why, let gentlemen look his ward, to the College at Hertford, if he to any one of the learned professions; could qualify him elsewhere? (Hear, hear, would they not find that certain disabilities hear!) If ever a literary preparation was were in them annexed to misconduct? requisite for those who were afterwards to There were, again, a variety of inconvefill a public post, it would be highly requi- niencies attached to the learned profes

. site in the case of those who were to go out sions; but reclly he wondered that the to India. It would be requisite all the Hon. Proprietor (Mr. Kinnaird) did not time they might remain in England, but think it was a very hard thing that the it would be most requisite at College. young gentlemen should be under the na. The service of the Company required that cessity of cro«sing the seas, and that he these youths should be of good discipline did not propose that they should be allowed as well as of good abilities; of good to provide themselves with air balloons in morals, and of good conduct and acquire- order to make the voyage. - (Along.) ments. What father or guardian then, su . The Hon. Gentlemen really appeared to peradded to those terms which must be think, that it was such a hardship to take necessarily kept for the purpose of acquir up these appointments, that it was a woning all literary attainments, would, if the der any body would accept one-(huar). Hon. Gentleman's principle was correct, It was now necessary that he should m. ke expose a young man to the unnecessary a similar declaration to That which they difficulty of seeking those high-laid attain. heard the other day from the Hon. Proments at Hertford ?

(Hear!) What prietor, who thought it proper to assure parent would think of sending his children the Court that he had been but twice in there at all?. (Hear :). But then the the Marquess of Hastings' company. He college would be deserted; and if the (Mr. Poynder) had never been in the concollege was not to be kept up, what was pany of any of these Professors once : le to become of it? Who was to pay for

hoped, therefore, to have credit for disiait? True it was, that the Hon. Gentleman terestedness, equal to the Hon. Gentle. (Mr. Kinnaird) had offered for its conti man's, in the part he had taken on this nuance the aid of his purse: but he (Mr. subject; a subject which, as a Proprietor Poyuder) was not so liberal. He would of India Stock, he thought extremely not support it at all if it was not well

important (har:) The Court, according worth supporting. But here would be a to the old adage, had better leave well College half full, and a test half efficient, alone. It would be worse than an absurand much expense attached to both. Though dity to attempt to remedy an institution, he (Mr. Poynder) might be impressed which had sent forth individuals so distinwith the strength of the arguments that guished for moral character and consehad been used in favour of the education quence; and let it be remembered that, given at our universities and public schools, next year, it would have been established this proposition to which he nearly twenty years,

The objections to protested that he could not subscribe. it, in its present state, arose out of some Much had been said about the natural little irregularities, and of the consequen, liability of every man to a desire of edu ces necessarily attending them. He hoped cating his own children after his own gentlemen would pause, therefore, before

Now this did seem to him com. they consented to the motion of the Hon. pletely a “ reductio ad absurdum:" (hear!) Proprietor; before they gave themselves up to talk about a liberal education being to follow the ignis fatuus of that Hon. forced, forsooth, upon young men ;

to talk Gentleman's eloquence, into every bog of forcing upon them the golden chains which it would lead them into, and every of India patronage; to talk of their being whirlpool in which it would involve them, expected, before they were called on to (hear!) preside over the happiness and well-being Mr. Rigby said, that if he understood of millions of subjects, to qualify them - the question before the Court, it was not selves in this manner; to consider that what the Hon. Gentleman who had just this was imposing a hardship upon them- spoken had described it to be. This was (hear, hear!) It had been ably said by not a question as to whether the old road a gentleman who stood next door to the was built on a bad and infirm foundation, Directors-educate your officers properly! and ought therefore to be wholly done


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away with; but, whether there should not in all he had said. While it was necessary be another avenue opened to the public, by to have an institution for the study of the which individuals might be admitted into oriental languages in this country, it seemed the Company's service, as well as through equally necessary (as the Hon. Gent. stated) their college. The two Hon. Gentlemen that they who were to learn them ought to who had spoken last had, with considerable go through a very regular and extensive eloquence, described what they thought the course of other studies. But here he (Mr. effect of the Company's college system Weeding) must step short in his concurwas, and what the system of other colleges rence; for the Hon. Gent., thinking that would be; but the immediate question it would be a more useful course for the seemed really to be, aye or no, would this young men themselves, as well as benefi. Court sanction an application to Parlia cial for the public and the Company, re. ment, to abrogate the exclusive right which commended that they should proceed to the College at Hertford at present possessed, their Colleges in the usual form-after the of qualifying young men sent out to India manner of the great schools of Eton, Winunder the Company's patronage? whether chester, and Harrow : so that young men they should be still required, in short, to under these circumstances (for this was the undergo the previous ordeal which the view he took of the matter) were to be left college required them to pass.

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to seek their knowledge where they could. upon this question that the Court were The object of the Company, in the insti. conclusively to determine. Now it seemed tution of the College at Hertford, was to to him that they had hitherto confined prepare in the best manner, by a most carewithin very narrow limits the objects of ful education, those who were to go out to their patronage, in regard to appointments India to fill appointments. The means of in India. The Hon. Proprietors who had effecting this object could only be derived brought forward and advocated the propo- through the regulations of a College ; and sition of this day, had distinctly stated, in the act of Parliament which confirmed that it was not their desire that the college the establishment, there were a certain now in existence should be abolished; and number of clauses, enjoining that all young they had paid great compliments to many men having such destinations should pass of the learned professors who were placed four terms, or remain two years in resithere. But they raised this doubt,-in dence at that College before they should which he quite concurred- namely, whe proceed to India. The act confirmed the ther the objects of the Company's patron- College statutes and regulations framed by age ought to be exclusively educated at the Court of Directors with the consent of Hertford, or whether the general interests the Broad of Controul. Now gentlemen and prosperity of the Company would not would give him leave to say, that he thought be better consulted byextendir.g their favour their object had not been accomplished to equally deserving individuals, though that their means had been unequal to the they happened to have qualified them end proposed ; and as much had been selves elsewhere? For a proposition of the said for and against university educations, latter nature he was prepared to give his vote he would beg to ask a few questions. Was undoubtedly. He thought there was great the government or management of India reason and justice in what an Ilon. Gen of more importance to the world than the tleman (Mr. Kiunaird) had said, “ that government of European kingdoms and this was altogeilaer an extremely proper states? And yet how did they who presubject for the consideration and the report sided over the governments of Europe ohthereon of the Court of Directors." He tain their education ? Were their attainwished that course had been adopted, and ments acquired by being compulsorily tied still hoped that it would be.

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to one spot? Was it in this way that future certain, that from the debate of this day statesmen acquired their knowledge and the public could receive no other impres. experience ? He would ask the Hon. Prosion but that of respect for the college and prietor who spoke last, whether an educaits professors : or if any other impression tion grounded at one of our public schools, should unhappily be made by the state and afterwards confirmed by a four years' ment which would go forth to the public connexion with one of our universities, of the day's proceedings, it would be pro was not likely to furnish a man with a duced by the speech of the Ilon. Proprie- vastly greater share of general knowledge tor who spoke last. He bad discussed a and experience, than the keeping of four proposition which went far beyond that of terms or a residence of two years in the the Hon. Mover himself; for this (Mr. College at Hertford? (Hear!) The Hon. Kinnaird's) merely went to inquire, whe Gent., after briefly stating the course in ther some other avenue ought not to be which a young man travelled from the opened to the public than the existing es public schools to his college, expressed his tablishment.

conviction that he might become qualified Mr. Weeding, concurring in many of the at twenty-two years of age. He would sentiments expressed by the Hon. Pro now quote them a passage from a pamprietor (Mr. Kinnaird), could not concur pblet published about seven years ago, which

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