“the sum of one hundred pounds for value re"ceived. 66 Pray let me have it this evening at all <events. "M. A. C." 37. "Mrs. Clarke's compliments attend captain Sandon, will feel herself much ob"liged if he will do his best for Thompson in "the recruiting business, as on his getting the men early will give him first rank. "Mrs. C. has not been able to get an answer "from h. r. b. about Taylor. "Dec. 26. "Colonel Sandon, No, 8, Lyon's-inn, "street." Dec. 26, 1804. 7 o'Clock 26 Dec. 1804. N n. 2 Two Py. Dec. 26th, 1804. POST Blandford. 38. "Mrs. C. must again intreat the assist"ance of colonel S He well knows she "has always done as he has wished her to do. "Colonel Sandon, No. 8, Lyon's-inn, Whych"street." 39. "I am told an answer is left out for "colouel French, at the office, and that he now "has dropped three guineas per man.-- "I am not aware of what the answer is in"tended to convey. 40. "Mr. Corri [torn.] k will. "I hope you will not disappoint me, as " on you alone depends my hopes of taking up a bill over due. "Colonel Sandon." 41. 66 the country, viz., of there being a probability of an adjustment of the differences between this country and the United States of America. Those reports I have. unfortunately found to be erroneous; and I. now feel it to be my duty to bring forwarda motion upon this most important subject. It is now of no consequence, whether the Orders in Council were the cause, or one of the causes, of the American Embargo. That question is now set at rest; a propoWhych-sition having been made in August last to this government on the part of the United States, to suspend the Embargo with respect to this country, if we would rescind our Orders in Council; it is clear therefore, whatever might have been the case before, that since last August the continuance of our Orders in Council is the sole cause of the continuance of the American Embargo, inasmuch as that would be removed if they were rescinded. And, if I could be induced to imagine these Orders in Council to have been, previous to last August, consistent with the principles of justice, the rights of nations, or sound policy, still, my lords, the question has, since. that period, assumed a different shape, and we must consider the question as it relates generally to our policy towards the United States. From the year 1783 to the commencement of the last war, the line of pɔlicy pursued by this country towards America, was conciliation; that was the system adopted by the administration of the late Mr. Pitt, and it was continued on the commencement of that war, when it became still more the policy of this country to conciliate America. Accordingly, in the year 1794 a Treaty of Commerce was concluded with the United States, which although said by some persons in this country to be too favourable to America, and by some persons in America to be too favourable to this country, was, I believe, an impartial treaty, giving to neither party too great an advantage over the other. The amity and the friendship between the two countries continued till he termination of that treaty. Some differences subsequently arose, and two years ago, when I was called to his majes ty's councils, I conceived it to be my duty immediately to set about atchieving, if possible, that important object, the adjustment of our differences with America. was highly satisfactory to me, that the details of this negociation devolved into abler hauds than mine, and a treaty was concluded. No sooner was it known that "2, Westbourne-place, Sloan-square, Dear Sir; Let me know where you are, " and I have not the least doubt but I can serve you essentially, and remain as ever "your friend. MARY ANNE CLARKE." Captain Sandon, Waggon Train, Spain. 2d Dec. 1808. PORTSMOUTH, Jan. 29, 1809. HOUSE OF LORDS. Friday, February 17. [AMERICA ORDERS IN COUNCIL.] The order of the day for summoning their lordships having been read, Lord Grenville rose and spoke as follows: It will be in the recollection of your lordships, that I gave notice towards the latter end of last session of a motion grounded upon the Evidence which had then recently been taken at the bar, to address his majesty to rescind the Orders in Coun cil. I was induced to withdraw that notice in consequence of some favourable reports which I then heard as grateful to my feelings, as, if realised, they would have provedbeneficial to the best interests of It a treaty had been concluded, and before sweeping them from it. They therefore its provision could be known, than every issued their Orders in Council to compel engine was set to work by persons in this the vessels of an independent state to pay country, who were determined to leave duties to the British Government, for leave no means untried to provoke hostility to carry on their trade. It was natural, with America, and the most gross misre- that the people of the United States should presentations were made of the object and be jealous of such an extraordinary attack provisions of the treaty. I waited with upon their independence; it was natural impatience until the treaty could be pub- that that jealousy should be the greater, lished; it was at length sent back from from the circumstance of their independAmerica and published, and then it was ence having been so recently acknowseen how grossly untrue these misrepre- ledged by this country. This attempt to sentations had been; it was then discover- levy duties upon the ships and merchaned, that whilst every provision had been dize of the United States, bears a ciose made fairly to conciliate America, the analogy to the attempt made forty years greatest care had been taken to main- ago, to levy taxes in America, which tain the maritime rights and maritime caused the revolution that ultimately superiority of this country, and that in this severed those colonies from the pareut respect we had been more provident than state. I hope, my lords, the system now the noble earl opposite, his majesty's Se- pursued will not plunge the two countries cretary of State, had been, in a communi- into hostilities, so fatal to their best incation made by him to the government of terests; but, unfortunately, there appears the United States, in which he laid down a determination in the part of his main some sort a basis for a new Treaty.jesty's government, to do every thing, Upon this head we had decidedly the ad- that can tend to force on that very hostilivantage in the treaty we concluded; ty, which is so much to be deprecated. having done away the effect of the unwise What have they attempted to do by these proposition made by the noble earl. By Orders in Council but to deprive the peothat time the noble lords opposite, and ple of the United States in reality of their their colleagues, had been called to his independence, by forcing them to bring all majesty's councils, and they determined their productions to this country, to pay on pursuing a line of conduct totally diffe- duty, and thus to reduce them again in rent from the system we had thought it effect to the situation of colonies of this our duty to adopt. With reference to Ire- country. It is well known that there is land, to the Northern Powers, to America, a vulgar notion in America, that it is the every part of their system was totally dif- object of the British Government to deferent. I am glad it was so-1 do not stroy their independence, and to reducemean to say that I am glad to see such a them again to the situation of colonies. system pursued, but seeing what their po- It cannot be supposed for a moment that licy is, I am glad that it is totally different any enlightened statesman, or even any to what ours was. After their ill-advised man of common sense in this country, and unjust expedition to Copenhagen, can be desirous that the United States America was the only neutral power that should again become the colonial possescould be looked to, and one would have sions of this country. It is a well-known thought that his majesty's government and notorious fact, that the commerce, would have gladly sought to conciliate the wealth, and the prosperity of this America, seeing that nearly all Europe country have been greatly increased in was combined against us, and shut against consequence of the revolution by which our trade; and that America opened to us a the colonies, now forming the United market capable of taking nearly all our States, were separated from this country, commerce, and with the probability, that and it is impossible that any man of comwith the increasing prosperity and popula- mon sense can wish that they should be tion of this branch of the parent state, the again brought back to the situation of market would be in no very long period colonies. What, however, is the effect so extended, that we should scarcely be of the Orders in Council? They were able, with all our means, to supply it. clothed in a number of words which even His majesty's ministers, unfortunately, those who framed them scarcely underursued a different line of conduct: Ame- stood; which were very difficult to be underica covered the ocean with her ships, and stood by others. But what has been their is majesty's ministers determined on effect, for to their practical effect we must look in considering the extent and relations of these measures? America, in the present state of the world, is the only country upon which they could operate; and with respect to America, their effect is to produce a colonial monopoly of all the merchandize of the United States, which is to be brought to this country to pay duty before it can be conveyed to any part of the world. How, then, must such a measure operate upon the minds of the people of America, jealous of their newly acquired independence, and still more jealous of this country, from the notion which I before stated to prevail amongst them; how much must such a measure tend to alienate their minds from this country? We were told in high sounding language when these measures were before parliament, of the sums, which would be raised by the duties levied upon neutral commerce, of rendering the commerce of the enemy tributary to this country, and of making the enemy himself contribute largely to the expences of the war, and to relieve the pressure and the burdens of the people of this country. What, my lords, has been the revenue actually raised from this source, the productiveness of which was so pompously announced? It appears by a statement of the produce of the duties levied under the Orders in Council Acts, up to the 5th of January, that they have produced the enormous Sum of Thirty-one thousand pounds! Thirty-one thousand pounds, my lords, to relieve the pressure and burdens of the people, and to contribute largely to the expences of the war; and this sum levied upon vessels brought by force into our ports. (A cry of No, no! from the other side of the house!) It has been, however, partly levied upon vessels brought by force into our ports, and partly upon these coming in voluntarily. In looking at such a sum thus produced, it may well be asked, as it was with respect to the Tax on Tea, forty years ago, in America, what price do we pay for this paltry revenue? and yet the Tea Duty would have produced mints and millions, compared with the produce of the Duties, levied under that unjust and impolitic measure, the Orders in Council. When I contemplate such a paltry issue derived from this measure, so much boasted of, for the benefit which it was to confer upon the country, I cannot impute to his majesty's ministers so much ignorance as to suppose they had any other motive in carrying into effect the Orders in Council than to force America into hostility. I do not wish to have this expression considered as uttered in the warmth of argument, for I do firmly believe, that it is the object of his majesty's ministers to do every thing in their power to force America into hostility with this country. It is incumbent upon me, my lords, to declare my retractation of an opinion which I had taken up in consequence of an erroneous impression from an expression used in the President's Message to Congress, and which I was at first induced to believe displayed a greater partiality to France than to this country, in offering to the former power to become a party in the war against this country. I had no further information upon the subject.-Ministers ought to have been informed upon it, and yet the noble earl, his majesty's Secretary of State, argued, that this partiality to France was actually evinced; that this difference in the overtures made to the two countries actually took place, although it is now perfectly clear that there was no difference, that there was no greater partiality to France, than to this country, and that the propositions made to the two countries, were not merely in effect, but were verbatim the same. attentive consideration, even of the expression in the Message of the President, which has been so much misrepresented, will clearly prove that the difference stated to exist between the propositions made to the two countries, was not stated by him to exist. The expression in the Message, to which I allude, is this: "The instructions to our ministers, with respect to the different belligerents, were necessarily modified with a reference to their different circumstances, and to the condition annexed by law to the executive power of suspension, requiring a degree of security to our commerce, which would not result from a repeal of the Decrees of France. Instead of a pledge, therefore, for a suspension of the Embargo as to her, in case of such a repeal, it was presumed that a sufficient inducement might be found in other considerations, and particularly in the change produced by a compliance with our just demands, by one belligerent, and a refusal by the other, in the relations between this other and the United States." An It must be clearly evident that the repeal of the French Decrees, would not give the necessary security to the commerce of America, and therefore it was not thought necessary to offer to the French government the repeal of the Em-ture of the propositions made by America bargo in return; but it was offered to to France. The nature of the propositions France, that if she would repeal her De- made to France, is distinctly proved by a crees, and we refused to rescind our Orders reference to the Instructions given to gein Council, that America would then be at neral Armstrong, the American minister war with this country; but it was offered at Paris, the material words of which will to us, not merely that if we repealed our be found to be verbatim the same with the Orders in Council, and France refused to instructions to Mr. Pinkney here, with rescind her Decrees, America would be respect to the change that would be made at war with France, but that the Em- in the relations with either power refusbargo should be suspended with respect to ing to repeal its Decrees or Orders, the this country. Thus the greater advantage other power consenting to rescind them. was offered to as, instead of any partiality It is therefore perfectly clear that no parbeing shewn to France. That this was tiality was evinced towards France; and explained to his majesty's ministers, and it is also evident, that his Majesty's mimust have been understood by them, ap-nisters must have known that such was pears clearly from the papers on the table. In a letter from Mr. Pinkney to Mr. Secretary Canning, dated the 23d of August, 1808, will be found the following passage. "If, as I propose, your Orders should be rescinded as to the United States, and our Embargo rescinded as to Great Britain, the effect of these concurrent acts will be, that the commercial intercourse of the two countries will be immediately resumed; while, if France should adhere to maxims and conduct, derogatory to the neutral rights of the United States, the Embargo continuing as to her, will take the place of your Orders, and lead with an efficacy not merely equal to theirs, but probably much greater, to all the consequences that ought to result from them. On the other hand, if France should concur in respecting those rights, and commerce should thus regain its fair immunities, and the law of nations its just dominion, all the alleged purposes of the British Orders will have been at once fulfilled. If I forbear to pursue these ideas through all the illustrations of which they are susceptible, it is because the personal conferences to which I have before alluded, as well as the obvious nature of the ideas themselves, render it unnecessary."--In these personal conferences, there can be no doubt that the propositions made by America were fully explained, and by the subsequent Note from Mr. Sccretary Canning to Mr.ject. It is well known, I believe, that Pinkney, dated the 23d of Sept. it must appear evident that his majesty's ministers were convinced that no such partiality, as alledged, had been shewn by the United States to France. There is another Letter from Mr. Secretary Canning, published in an American paper, but which is not amongst the Correspondence on the table, in which it still more clearly appears that ministers were fully aware of the real na the fact. I cannot help, however, whilst upon this correspondence, remarking upon. the monstrous principle assumed in the note of Mr. Secretary Canning, to which I before alluded, in which he states, that the Orders in Council were founded: "on the unquestionable right of his majesty to retort upon the enemy the evils of his own injustice, and upon the consideration that, if third parties incidentally suffered by these retaliatory measures, they were to seek their redress from the power by whose original aggression that retaliation was occasioned.' Is it because the enemy has been guilty of gross injustice, that therefore we are to commit injustice? Are we to imitate the enemy in his crimes, and commit the same enormities because he has committed them? Upon this principle we might, because he has unjustly invaded the territory of an ally; send a king of our own choosing to Sweden or to Sicily, and force them to accept of him. The principle here assumed does not hint at the acquiescence of a neutral, but claims at once the general and sweeping right of retaliating upon the enemy his own injustice, whether neutrals acquiesced in it or not. I cannot also help remarking upon the chain of irony and sarcasm adopted in this note, a style new to diplomatic correspondence, and which is wholly unsuited to the sub the passage alluding to the inconvenience which must be occasioned in America by the Embargo, produced, when read in Congress, an universal sentiment of indignation. It is absolutely essential that independent states, however one may be inferior to the other in power, should nego ciate on the footing of equality. And how, I ask, would it be received here, if the government of the United States, in any official correspondence with this coun- it is my duty to impress upon your attentry, should allude for instance, to the sup- tion, however painful the task, some of posed effect of any measure adopted by the melancholy consequences of these this government upon the manufacturers Orders in Council. The diminution of of Lancashire. My lords, the only ground our commerce from the operation of this upon which the Orders in Council have measure is an evil of alarming magnitude. been defended in this house, has been the It appears by the documents on the table acquiescence of America in the Decrees that the exports, which in the year ending of France. It is now clearly proved, that the 10th of October, 1807, amounted to if America ever did acquiesce in these De- 48,500,000l., amounted in the year ending crees, she no longer does so. It is now the 10th of October, 1808, to only clearly ascertained, that America has 42,300,000l. a diminution of 6,200,0007.; offered you to suspend her Embargo, if the diminution of imports in the same peyou rescind your Orders in Council, and riod amounts to 5,200,000l. In this stateto go to war with France, if France then ment, also, it should be recollected that refuses to repeal those parts of her Decrees Ireland and Scotland, a great part of which affect the neutral rights of America. whose trade was with America, are not Here, then, is a clear proposition, which included; giving them therefore, a protakes away the only ground, upon which portionate share, the diminution of our the Orders in Council stood, upon which commerce may be fairly estimated at they were defended by noble lords on the 14,000,000l. It should also be recollected, other side. This only ground being taken that this diminution has taken place in a away, it of course clearly and obviously year during four months of which the follows, that the Orders in Council ought Orders in Council did not operate, these to be rescinded. If, however, we are to Orders not having been issued till Novemjudge from the Note to which I last allu- ber, and not being in full operation till Jaded, the experiment is to be tried, whether nuary. In the article of wool, the staple we can exist without the commerce of commodity of the country, and in a numAmerica, with all Europe combined ber of other articles, an alarming diminution against us, and thus the vital interests has taken place, and also in the importation. of the country are to be wantonly ha- of raw materials, essential to our manufaczarded. I have heard of a man who was ture. A number of cotton mills have in desperately wounded, but there being consequence been stopped, and the workseveral wagers laid as to whether he could men thrown out of employ. The great imrecover from his wound, no surgical assis-portance of the linen manufacture of Iretance was allowed to be given him, in order that the experiment might be tried, at the hazard of his life, whether he could recover or not. So, it seems as if ministers wished to try a similar experiment with the country, and that because France has said that we cannot exist with Europe shut against us, and without the commerce of America, that therefore the experiment is to be tried, and the very vital interests of the country put to hazard. The noble earl (Bathurst) has this night moved for some Returns respecting our North American colonies. It does seem most extraordinary that at such a critical moment, the force in these colonies should have been sent to atchieve a distant object, with no probability of success, which has since failed, and which, if it had succeeded, would have been of no consequence, would have been merely the acquisition of another sugar island, an object which at the present moment can surely be deemed of no importance. I hope that force has since returned to its former station,-My lords, land is well known, and the difficulty in procuring flax-seed is at present a serious evil; of 45 hogsheads required for sowing, 35 must be procured from America. In consequence of the interruption of the trade with America the price of flaxseed, which was from 21. to 31. per quarter, has risen to from 221. to 241. per quarter. It is now February, and if the necessary quantity of flax-seed is not procured before May, the consequences will, indeed, be serious. Another evil, my lords, of serious magnitude, is the deficient supply of corn; it is well known that we do not grow enough for our own consumption, and that as the ports in the north of Europe are now shut against us, we can only look to America for an adequate supply, and I need not point out to your lordships the distressing consequences which must result from the want of such a supply. I wish, however, to be distinctly understood upon one point, with respect to the maritime rights and the maritimne superiority of the country, The evils which I |