giving his hearty affent to the motion before the House: but it was rather a gloomy prefage of that union fo ftrongly encouraged, that the very first time he happened to agree with him, it was upon grounds and for reafons the moft oppofite. He agreed, that in the prefent critical fituation of affairs, a firm, efficient, extended and united Adminiftration was abfolutely neceffary to this country: but then the union must be formed upon principle and upon honour; and any union. which fhould be propofed, that he should find inconfiftent with principle and with honour, he would most certainly oppofe. As to the sense of the people of England, with refpect to the late proceedings in Parliament and the change of Minifters, it would not, perhaps, be decent for him to fay as much as might be faid upon that fubject: but thus much he might venture to fay, that he was perfectly fatisfied in his own mind, that the fense of the people was in favour of the late change of Minifters. He would not, however, notwithftanding this general opinion of the people, agree with an honourable Baronet, (Sir Cecil Wray) that there was no diftractions in the country; for whoever confidered the ftate in which that House had been for fome time paft, and the confequent fufpenfion of all public bufinefs, muft agree that there were distractions in the country. With regard to a refignation before a treaty for an anion fhould take place, he faid he would repeat what he had fo often faid before, that he forefaw the greatest evils to the nation, if his Majesty's present Ministers should give up their employments; and he made no difficulty in saying, that neither his principles nor his feelings inclined him to refign under fuch circumftances: but ftill fo little was he attached to office, that if he could fee a profpect of a strong and well-connected Government ready to fucceed him, he would chear fully retire, without feeling the least defire to form a part of fuch a Government; how paltry would it then be in him to refign now, for the fole purpose of treating about returning back to office.

Mr. Byng rofe to juftify his conduct relative to the Mid- Mr. Byng, dlefex addrefs. declaring that the meeting had not been called by any friends of his, and that the place of meeting, (the Shepherd and Shepherdefs) had been appointed by one Sheriff only. When the meeting affembled, the attendance of freeholders was fo numerous, that complaint was made that there was not room enough. The address voted at that meeting, Mr. Byng faid, was voluntarily voted: but he reminded Mr. Pitt, that it did not appear in the London Gazette immediately, as the addreffes of a different tendency had appeared;

Ld. North.

Sir Cecil

Wray.

nor was it inferted until he had written to the right honourable gentleman a fpecial letter, requesting that it might be published. Mr. Byng faid, the Weftminster addrefs. had been furreptitiously obtained. It was true, he acknowledged, that the India bill of his right honourable friend had been unpopular, because it had been mifreprefented and mifunderstood, that bill, he admitted alfo, had drawn much odium on the late, Administration but when the right honourable gentleman's bill over the way came before the public, and was compared with that of his right honourable friend, the odium changed its fituation, and was transferred entirely to the bill of the right honourable gentleman, which was allowed to be by far the most objectionable. Mr. Byng profeffed great respect and deference for his conftituents, declaring, whenever he knew what their fentiments were upon any great question, he would either implicitly obey them, or retire from their fervice; and this resolution, he said, they well knew his feat, therefore, in that House, was held on a more precarious tenure than that of any other gentleman.

Lord North began his fpeech with declaring, from the best authority, that the name and fanction of the Dean of Weftminfter had been made use of without his cognizance. This fact ascertained, his Lordfhip proceeded to reply to Mr. Pitt's arguments, most of which he answered. Speaking of the addreffes, he faid, that the loweft burgeffes of Taunton, of Southampton, and of other boroughs, could not be supposed to be competent to judge of fuch fubjects as the India bill, and therefore, though the voice of the people without doors ought to have its degree of weight, it was not to be relied on in a cafe of that kind, or put in comparison with the judgement of that House, which had fpent three whole years in the most minute investigation of India affairs. His Lordfhip fpoke of the laudable efforts of the meeting at the St. Alban's tavern in terms of warm eulogium; and contrafted the conduct of the Duke of Portland and Mr. Pitt towards that meeting, in order to fhew that a Member of the other House of Parliament had evinced a ftronger inclination to comply with the wishes of the House than one of its own Members.

Sir Cecil Wray in reply faid, the Dean and burgeffes of Weftminster was the ftile of that court. Sir Cecil denied that the Westminster addrefs had been furreptitiously obtained He faid it was figned by four thoufand inhabitants; and their opinions were more honourably and fairly obtained than they could have been by a confused holding up of hands.

Mr.

Mr. Hammet faid he could not fit quiet without making Mr. Hamfome obfervations upon what had fallen from the noble Lord met. in the blue ribband, and feveral other gentlemen, who had talked of the arts which had been made ufe of o procure addreffes. He begged leave to affure the noble Lord, that he had never heard of the addrefs of the town of Taunton ill the moment it was delivered into his hands. The noble Lord had faid it was figned by the lowest burgeffes of the town. The noble Lord, he faid, was Recorder of that town; and he could with truth affert, that the addrefs was figned by men of all defcriptions, many of them had been friends of the noble Lord, and that it was refpectable for the wealth, good fense and independence of the gentlemen who had thought proper to tranfmit their fentiments to Hi Majefty. He vindicated the honour of the town with great fpirit. He faid, he had the honour of attending the meeting of the merchants and traders at the London tavern. He maintained that their address to the Throne was debated fairly, and carried unanimoufly; that he was happy in the opportunity of declaring, that they were honourable in every fenfe of the word, incapable of being influenced by any other motives than those they profeffed, of duty to the King, and a fincere love for the Conftitution. He then adverted to the addrefs of the county of Middlefex: he faid, that his fituation and profeffion made him acquainted with many of the freeholders; that they had affured him, that the room was taken poffeffion of at an early hour,, that they did not know even the meaning of the addrefs, that they thought it contained fentiments directly oppofite, and that he believed the county would take measures, and find the means to convey their real opinions to the Throne. He faid, he fhould have gone farther, but that he did not fee the honourable Member in his place. He then begged leave to fay a few. words on the India bill. The late right honourable Secretary had profeffed that he was ready to make any alterations in that bill, but that the principle of it he would not give up. Mr. Hammet faid, he had but few objections to the regulations propofed: but that it was the principle of the bill to which he ftrongly objected; and that if that bill had been brought in by the right honourable gentleman below him, (Mr. Pitt) high as his opinion was of his great abilities and integrity, he fhould have given it his negative. He then ftated his idea of the prerogative of the Crown to appoint Minifters, and contended, that whoever the King thought proper to entrust with the management of his government, ought to have a fair trial. This, he faid,

was

Ld, North.

Mr. Rolle.

was not the cafe of the present Minifters. He would fupport men for their measures; but would never fupport bad meafures for the fake of any man whatever. That in any other view but the good of his country, it was indifferent to him who was in or who was out of office. He faid, he was the first man who had expreffed his wifh for an union of the great abilities and virtues which adorned that House for the good of the nation; that an honourable and worthy Baronet, the member for Oxford, had that day done him the honour to agree with him in fentiment; fince which the fame idea had been taken up by the moft able and independent men in the House, and he fincerely wifhed, that their laudable endeavours might, in the end, be crowned with fuccefs. He faid, if the right honourable gentleman oppofite to him, (Mr. Fox) poffeffed found judgment, prudence and moderation, in addition to his other wonderful and fhining abilities, he would be more than human; he wished that he would now give a proof of it, by moving himself for the refolutions alluded to, to be refcinded, for he felt the House in a ftrange predicament: he was certain that the opinions of the Houfe differed from the opinions of their conftituents, and that the right honourable gentleman below him poffeffed at this moment the confidence and affection of the people at large in as eminent a degree as any minister had ever done.

Lord North got up to explain, and faid he had not seen the addrefs from Taunton-it might be respectable-but that he understood that no public meeting was called, and that it had been carried from houfe to house. He defired, however, he might not be misunderstood, or conceived to have meant any thing difrefpectful to the town of Taunton; there were many characters in that town every way refpectable and worthy.

Mr. Rolle rofe to speak to the point of Lord North's having reflected on the addreffes, and that they had been furreptitiously obtained. Though he was no friend to addreffes, thinking they rather tended to aggravate than conciliate, he could not fit filent and hear fuch afperfions thrown out, when he understood there had been two fent up from refpectable places in the county he represented; one from the city of Exeter, another from Plymouth; that they had been agreed to at a legal and conftitutional meeting, called by their respective chief magiftrates. He knew they were figned by many perfons of the most refpectable character, much more fo in the eyes of their country than the noble Lord. He was not furprised at his

def.

defpifing addreffes, when he recollected the very contemptuous manner in which the noble Lord had treated a memorial from the county of Devon, figned by the high fheriff and foreman of the grand jury, with, the unanimous con fent of the meeting, to which his Lordship would not vouchfafe to fend any anfwer. With refpect to the queftion before the Houfe, he certainly hoped they would confent to it. At another meeting, different conftructions had been put on it; in this debate he must give his reasons for affenting to it. He had no views of removing the right honourable gentleman oppofite (Mr. Pitt) nor was it the intention of the meeting; their object was to foften a former refolution, in order to remove the difficulty alledged, to pave the way for conferences between the contending leaders, to obtain an union on the basis of principle and honour fo much to be defired and wished for by all. That instead of thinking to remove the right honourable gentleman, on the contrary he wished to fupport him; as he believed he had the hearts and wifhes of the people with him, and as long as his measures were proper he fhould have his voluntary and hearty support. That whether the people were mafters of India matters was not the grounds for their difapprobation; it was the attack made on the Constitution; an attack which they confidered would render their Sovereign a mere cypher, and his Minifter a defpotic monarch,

Lord North rofe to explain; his Lordfhip faid, he had Ld. Northe given directions that a letter fhould be written as foon

as he heard of the matter alluded to by the honourable gentleman.

Mr. Rolle faid a few words in reply.

Mr. Thornton then made a short speech in favour of the

motion.

Mr. Grosvenor rofe again and faid a few words upon the intention of the meeting, when they came to a refolution to propose the motion to the House, which he had that day the honour to move.

The question was now put, and carried without a negative.

Mr. Coke (of Norfolk) then rofe, and in a fhort speech Mr. Cokej took notice that his honourable colleague and he used formerly to think alike, and to act upon the fame principles. He was forry that they did not continue to act fo now, VOL. XIII.

H

and