gentleman, than against it. Having premifed this, Mr. Thornton enumerated the different grounds of objection that had been taken against the bill. When firft brought in, he faid, it had been objected to as a grant of country which His Majefty had no right to give. The fact was, it granted no land whatever, but enabled His Majefty to grant fuch land as he should hereafter poffefs in confequence of purchases to be made. Another objection was, that the bill was calculated to establish a monopoly. This alfo had been refuted, and it had been fhewn, that it was no monopoly, but that it was intended to fecure a fet of gentlemen, who upon public fpirited. motives, mixed with fome fpeculative views of commerce, were willing to venture a certain capital, from being made anfwerable, with their private fortunes, for more than their respective shares in the undertaking.

Another ground of oppofition had arifen, from the West India merchants; and now they had to combat all thefe different oppofitions, reinforced with new objections. It was ftated, that they were about to take lands, which might involve this country in aferious quarrel with fome of the European powers; the French treaty, and the confequence of infringing on the rights of foreign nations, had likewife been talked of. Mr. Thornton repeated his affertions that the bill did not enable the King to grant lands belonging to any Prince, nor did it infringe the rights of any country whatever. He admitted that Englishmen had a right to trade all arround the coast of Africa, and other nations had the fame right, and were therefore precifely in the fame fituation that they were before. No perfon whatever, who had, or could be fuppofed to have, any particular interest in the trade, objected to the prefent bill. Mr. Anderfon, he declared, was the only gentleman interested, or who came within that defcription, and Mr. Anderfon did not object to it. It was a little extraordinary, Mr. Thornton obferved, that on a late queftion, viz. the motion for an abolition of the flave trade, two of the arguments, most insisted on, had been, that nothing was to be produced in Africa but flaves, and that the Weft Indies could not be cultivated without flaves; and yet the prefent bill was objected to by fome of the gentlemen who had held thofe arguments; they now turned the tables on the friends to abolition, and faid they were going to fet forward a cultivation, which ought to be checked; and oppofed their attempting to effect their defign by the employment of free people, as they had bound themfelves not to employ flaves.

Mr. Thornton ftated the bill, to be a bill calculated to give effect to the public fpirit of a few gentlemen, who were willing to rifque fome lofs, which they muft neceffarily ex

4E 2

pect

Mr. Cawthorne.

Sir Wm.

pect in the outfet of their undertaking, and to make a fair experiment at cultivation, where land had the misfortune not to be cultivated. Much of what Mr. Thornton faid, was intended as anfwers to Lord Sheffield's objections. He then added fome general obfervations on its being the interest of this country to encourage cultivation in every part of the world, and concluded with hoping, that upon a right com prehenfion of the real objects of his bill, the Houfe would think it ought to pass.

Mr. Cawthorne rofe to explain, and chiefly confirmed what he faid in that part of his argument, which had gone to fhew, that the bill gave the company an exclufive trade, which might prove obnoxious to France and other na

tions.

Sir William Young faid, when the bill had been first moved Young for, he had been nained as one of the gentlemen to prepare it, as it was fuppofed he must be friendly to fuch propofition; and he had prevailed on the honourable gentleman who moved it, to defer the fecond reading of the bill till after the queftion of the abolition of the flave trade was difpofed of, which the honourable gentleman had complied with. From the arguments which he had ufed upon the queftion of the flave trade, Sir William, declared he held himself bound to fupport the bill, which he did moft cordially, confefling that he thought the honourable gentlemen who were concerned, were praife-worthy for the experiment. He faid, he was no friend to monopolies, and he was employing a part of his fortune in endeavouring to break up one monopoly; he meant the Hudson's Bay Company. Sir William obferved, that he had on a former day difclaimed the refolutions that might be come to upon the fubject of the bill by the meeting of the Weft-India merchants, and in confequence, he faid, his name had been improperly made ufe of, and his fentiments miftated. He explained the nature of the meetings of Weft-India merchants, and faid they did not always meet to concur with the Weft-India planters. He spoke highly of the refpectability of the merchants, who affembled at fuch meetings, and faid, he bowed to their character, and he bowed to their understanding, but he could not how to their dictates, because the Weft-India iflands had legiflatures of their own, and, as a Member of Parliament, he never would admit that any meeting here, however respectable and well informed the perfons affembled at them might be, had a righ to take upon themfelves to fpeak for the legislatures of the Weft-India iflands, or to answer what their condu& would be. Sir William fuggefted an amendment which he thought ncceffary in the bill.

Με

Mr.

Mr. Buxton acknowledged it gave him pleafure to fee that a different mode of obtaining foreign territory had taken Buxton. place, in the inftance of Africa, from that which had hitherto prevailed in other quarters of the globe. The mark of a King Tom or a King Jamie fubfcribed to a grant, was to him infinitely more fatisfactory, than the abominable and barbarous practice of feizing upon territory by driving the inhabitants from their country. Mr. Buxton faid he was glad of the opportunity of declaring that, he lamented the not having being able to be in the Houfe to give his vote, and exprefs his abhorrence of the inhuman practice of the flave trade. Had he not been confined with illness, he fhould have been one of the moft zealous advocates for the abolition.

Mr.

Mr. Burrard confidered the bill as the firft ftep towards the civilization of Africa, and the confequent abolition of Burrard. the flave trade. He defended the preamble of the bill, which, he faid, had no difguife in it.

Mr. Stanley (Attorney General for the Leeward islands, Mr. and Agent for Nevis) opjected to the bill. He complained Stanley. of gentlemen's taking every opportunity to introduce the poor, unfortunate, profcribed Weft Indians; and charged feveral of the speakers in the debate with having gone out of their way to talk against the flave trade. He faid, the arguments he had the honour of ftating, when the queftion of the abolition of the flave trade had been under difcuffion, were certainly given in a loofe, deranged, and undigested hape, but they had been fincerely fpoken, and founded in perfonal knowledge and perfonal experience. After four months illness he had delivered fentiments, which being founded on the information obtained and collected from private papers, was more to be depended on, than any thing to be found in fpeculative ideas. Mr. Stanley faid, he was the first of a profcribed family which a century ago had been driven from England; and though he had now returned to fpend the remainder of his days in his native country, he affured the Houfe, that feelings of compaffion for the African flaves employed in the Weft India plantations, glowed as warmly in his breaft as in those of any gentleman who trod the floor of that Houfe; and he would inform them, that immediately after the queftion of the abolition of the flave trade had been difpofed of, every Agent to the iflands had written to their conftituents earneftly to advise them to take the firft opportunity of revifing their flaves laws, and ameliorate the ftate and condition of their flaves, telling them at the fame time that it would be the only poffible means of preventing the British Parliament from intermed

dling in a manner, neither agreeable to their wishes, nor con ducive to their interefts.

Mr. Stanley adverted to what Sir William Younge had faid, and having commented on the argument of the honourable Bart, with whom, he faid, he had enjoyed a long acquaintance, he proceeded to the immediate fubject, that of the bill before the Houfe; which he declared to be, in his mind, an act of felo de fe, as to its own avowed purpofes. He regretted that there were not more gentlemen of that profe fion of which he was an unworthy Member, prefent, to folve certain doubts which he entertained refpecting the legality of fome of the claufes of the bill. Mr. Stanley was here entering into a difcuffion of King Tom's grant, pronouncing it a circumstance that would render us the laughing stock of Europe; and questioning whether, according to the common rules of legal conveyance in this country, the district couli be fo conveyed; when he was informed by Mr. Thornter, that the clause he had alluded to, had been left out of the Lill, which did not contain one fyllable relative to King Tom or his grant. He then proceeded to fpeak of the fettlement of 1787, and of feveral other pertinent points, and declared that he had before opened his mind on the fubject to the ho nourable gentleman, and that he fpoke as a Member of Parliament, and not in any private character or capacity.

Mr. J. T. Mr. 7. T. Stanley rofe to fay a very few words. He de Stanley. clared he could not conceive that any objection could be en

Mr. M.

tertained to the execution of a fair experiment. When the queftion of the abolition of the flave trade had been agitated, it had been ftated that Africa could not be cultivated, and that it would yield no traffic but that of flaves; the bill under confideration aimed at fomething which would do away that argument, and which promised the greatest advantages by employing the Africans at home and cultivating the country; he was amazed therefore that the merchants fhoul make any oppofition to it.

Mr. M. Montagu rofe in fupport of the bill. When the Montagu. queftion of the abolition of the flave trade was under confide ration, he faid, the advocates for that trade had contended, that Africa could not be cultivated; and now they took to much upon themselves, when they refifted a bill to authoriz the cultivation of thirty miles only out of 12,000 leagues. Mr. Montagu obferved, that the friends and fupporters of the flave trade objected to the newly-intended company, 2 afking for an exclufive right, abfolutely neceffary to the object, when they themselves claimed an exclusive right to hol the African negroes in flavery.

Mr. Robert Thornton faid, he had feelings on the fubject, Mr. R. which he wished to communicate to the Houfe. He wifhed Thornton to fupport a bill brought in, and fo ably defended by his honourable relation, because it was calculated to relieve the miferable Africans, by opening a door to a more honourable and profitable trade, than that in flaves. It would tend to promote the happiness of millions. Thofe therefore mult vote for it, who gave way to the dictates of confcience, and the feelings of humanity.

Mr. Alderman Watfon declared he would not have rifen, Mr. Ald. but for fomething that had fallen from the honourable gen- Watson. tleman behind him, (Mr. J. T. Stanley.) That honourable gentleman had expreffed his surprise that the merchants 'fhould oppofe the bill. Mr. Watfon faid, he knew of no merchant in or out of that House who did oppose it. The merchants, he believed, were not against the paffing of the bill, the principle of which was the cultivation of mankind, and to find a vent for our manufactures; both of them laudable objects. The gentlemen, who were ready in a most public fpirited manner to rifque a part of their fortunes, defired not to be made answerable for more than their respective fhares. Was there any thing unreafonable in that? undoubtedly not; the Bank and the Eaft India Company enjoyed the fame advantage, in common with many other public companies. He had been one, the Alderman faid, who voted against the abolition of the flave trade, and he had oppofed it from motives as fair, and principles as pure, as those of any gentleman who fupported the other fide of that queftion. He was one alfo, who faid, that he did not think that the country of Africa could be cultivated; but if there were men enterprizing enough to attempt it, he thought they ought to be free to venture, and he would not oppose the execution of the experiment: Happy fhould he be, if the condition of those poor people could be meliorated.

Mr.

Mr. Hippefley thought that the gentlemen who fupported the bill, were infinitely too fanguine in their expectations. Hippesley. The experiment had been tried fome years fince, on the very fpot; and Mr. Hippefley obferved, that it had been his fate (very reluctantly) to have vifited that part of the coast of Africa in the fame year, when not one of ten of the perfons landed there with a view to form the fettlement, were to be found; the mortality had been fo great, that more than three-fourths had died within the year, and the reft had emigrated. A fort of exclufive right was now fet up, under a grant by one of the native Chiefs, called King Tom, which grant had been read, and authenticated by His Majefly's mark; and an application was now made to Parliament to confirm this ceffion. Mr. Hippefley faid, that during his own short refidence