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Mr. Croker, the motion was negatived | ing into consideration the model' upon without a division.
which it was formed. The justification of (Conduct of MARQUIS WELLESLEY.]— some of them was the persidy of the prince Lord Folkestone moved the order of the day who was dethroned; but would it be confor taking into consideration the papers; tended, that all the princes who had fallen and on the question that they be now the victims of his policy were equally pertaken into consideration,
fidious? And if a general view was taken Mr. Crecvey rose to give his negative to of the whole policy of his administration, the proposition, for two reasons: in the what light, he would ask, was there to first place, because it was impossible for guide the house in forming its decision? the house to come to a decision upon the 'The hon. gent. quoted the opinion of the conduct of the marquis Wellesley, without court of directors, as it was expressed in at the same time deciding upon the general a printed dispatch that had been published, question of Indian policy; and in the se in which that court, while it expressed a cond place, because it was quite impossi- high consideration for the talents of marq. ble that gentlemen could so have digested Wellesley, condemned in the most pointed materials which would fill seven volumes, terms, the general tenor of his administra. . and which had been collected from the tion, as contrary to the existing laws, as an
administration of that country, during a' open defiance of the authority of the direcperiod of 17 years, which had been tors, and as an attempt, on his part, to moved for by different persons, and convert the government of India into a with different views, and which brought simple despotism. In the same dispatch into comparison the administrations of lord the profusion of his expenditure was cenTeignmouth and the marquis Cornwallis snred, and the whole of his conduct to with that of the marquis Wellesley, as to foreign powers reprobated, as a departure be able to decide upon the merits of that from those principles of moderation by complicated system with which the con- which they were desirous that the goduct and character of the last mentioned vernor-general should be actuated.--Here nobleman were inseparably interwoven. The Chancellor of the Exchequer called The papers were in such confusion that it the hon. gent. to order, upon the ground was indispensible that they should be ar that at the opening of a proceeding, inranged before they could be perused, so stead of arguing upon matters of fact, he as to convey the information necessary to was bringing forward the opinions of those enable the house to form a judgment upon who were to be considered in the light of the faets to which they related ; and though accusers. he was pretty generally acquainted with Dr. Laurence on the other side, con: them, he had not met with three gentle- tended, that his hon. friend was completely men who had read them. The course, in order, because in stating his objections therefore, which he would recommend to the proceeding, it was certainly comwas, that they should be referred to a petent for him to mention the grounds of committee. He did not care how that those objections, and his reasons for thinkcommittee was formed. He had no ob- ing that a different course should be jection that the three brothers of the noble adopted. marquis should be members of it, and it The Chancellor of the Exchequer asserted, should be appointed exclusively by the that it was irregular to refer to opinions hon. gentlemen on the treasury bench. which were not before the house. As matters now stood, the house could not The Speaker then decided, that if this enter into a discussion of the question, he- parliament had refused the document which cause it was connected with a variety of the hon. member was quoting, it would others which required a detailed examina never consent to receive that indirectly tion. The question before the house was which it had directly refused. But if the the propriety of the treaty by which the paper had not been refused by this parNabob of Oude was dethroned and stript liainent, he was of opinion that the hon. of his territory. But this was not a soli gent. was perfectly in order when he made tary instance of this species of policy. use of it in the course of his argument. He had concluded many treaties of the Mr. Creevey proceeded to read another same kind, and each was referred to in his part of the dispatch, in which the system instructions to his agents as a model for adopted by the marquis Wellesley, for exthe other. They could not, therefore, tending the territory and increasing the decide upon one treaty without also tak revenues of the company, was reprobated
as unjust, illegal, and impolitie. He con men who had not made themselves masters tended, that it would be extremely rash of the papers, who, he was convinced, for the house, in the face of an opinion so formed a large majority of the house. decidedly pronounced by those who were Sir John Anstruther called the attention the best judges of the subject, and with an of the house to the present state of the unanimity almost unparalleled (this dis- proceedings. Three parliaments ago, a patch having been signed by 23 out on 24 charge had been brought against marquis Directors) to come to a decision with their , Wellesley, by an hon. gent. (Mr. Paull) present inadequate means of inforination, who was no longer a member of that house; directly the reverse of this opinion, which all the evidence necessary for supporting would be the effect of a resolution of ac the charge, had been moved for and grantquittal, passed in favour of marquis Wel- ed; an inquiry had been challenged by lesley. It ought to be considered, too, the friends of the noble marquis, the charge that the very circumstance of the marquis originally brought forward had been abanCornwallis having been sent out to super- doned, but upon the papers that had been sede marquis Wellesley, then in the prime produced, other accusations had been of life, in the government of India, was a founded by a noble lord, and this night proof that a disapprobation of his conduct had been fixed for the house to pronounce was not confined to the court of directors, upon the justice or injustice of these accubut that government likewise participated sations. Nothing had been said of any in it. It had been said, that any farther deficiency of evidence, or of any
confudelay would be extremely hard towards sion of papers, till about ten days ago. lord Wellesley. He admitted that it was He contended, that the delay now propohard upon lord Wellesley. But was there sed, was neither more nor less than an atnot a third party who likewise merited tempt to arrest the course of justice, in as some consideration ? Would it not be far as lord Wellesley was concerned, hard on the East India Company to be for the purpose of entering into a detailed defrauded of their possessions, in conse- examination of the affairs of India, and to qunce of his mal-administration? or would blend two subjects which were totally difit not be hard upon the country if, in con- ferent and distinct. The Dispatch which sequence of his measures, its Indian domi- had been read, ought to have no more nions should be severed from it for ever! weight with the house, than the opinion of What he wished was, that this question 24 printers, and it would have been only should be examined as all other Indian fair in the hon. gent. when he read it to questions had been examined. For if the the house, to have read also the Answer to noble marquis had, during his administra- it, which was made by the Board of Con: tion, furnished more materials for discus troul, whose opinion he thought was fully sion than any other governor, it would as valuable
upon such a question as that of scarcelybe maintained that, on that account, the Court of Directors. Upon the genea decision should be more speedily adopted. ral merits of lord Wellesley's administraHe thought that one of two expedients tion, he should be ready to meet either the should be recurred to, either that the hon. gent. or any other person, when they house ought to follow the same course came to be discussed. At present, that that had been pursued in 1772 and 1782, question was not before the house, and afand that a committee ought in the first ter the delay which had already taken place to be appointed to make a compleat place, he thought the house could not conrevision of the affairs of India, or that if sent to postpone their decision upon the lord Wellesley's condnct was to be dis- particular and personal charges, without eussed separately, that the evidence before committing an act of gross injustice to the them should be previously arranged by a noble and distinguished individual whose select committee, so as to render it intelli- character was implicated in them. gible; which it was not in its present form. Mr. Robert Thornton professed his deciWere parliament to come to a decision ded disapprobation most highly of many upon the conduct of that noble person by of the political measures of the noble marthis night's vote, he asserted it they would quis, at the same time he wished that the commit an act of injustice to the noble house should decide upon the charges that marquis, and that it would be wanting in had been brought against him with disits duty both to itself and to the country; patch as well as :with boldness. For this and in proposing some farther delay, he reason he was against the appointment of fully expected the support of those gentle-' a committee, betadse that mode of pro
ceeding would tend to postpone a decision another course of proceeding, he was not which had already been too long delayed. prepared to resist it. He hoped the house He animadverted with severity upon the would not judge of the conduct of the backwardness which had been shewn by court of directors on an er parte statement, some gentlemen at a certain period, to pro- but that their case, as well as that of the secute the charges which they had pledged noble marquis, would be considered with themselves to institute, and alluded par- reference to the whole of the circumstanticularly to the conduct of Mr. Sheridan, ces. in declining, while in the last administra Mr. Windham rose, amidst a loud cry tion, to bring forward the Carnatic ques- for the question. He said that he certion, because he found that it would not lainly should not be deterred from deliverbe agreeable to some of his colleagues. ing his sentiments on this occasion by any His wish was, that the character of lord such cry, more particularly as it was this Wellesley should be either cleared by a importunity for the question which he was vote of the house, or that the censure should desirous to combat, and which he hoped be passed upon him which his conduct had to be able to do with somewhat better armerited. He denied that the Directors of gument than mere clamour. He confessthe East India Company appeared as the 1 ed, however, that he had little to say, on accusers of lord Wellesley, but he, along the present occasion, in addition to what with many of his colleagues, had disap- he had stated on a former evening. The proved of many of his measures, and it question now before the house was, whewas necessary, in their own defence, that ther it would come to a decision now upon they should state the grounds of this dis- a subject of the greatest magnitude and approbation.
importance, or defer that decision till Mr. S. Lushington contended, that the they were competent to judge of it? If it only mode of doing justice either to mar was asked, why the house was not compequis Wellesley, to the injured natives of tent to decide upon it now, he would leave India, or to the character of the British it to every gentleman to give an answer nation, was to institute a general inquiry for himself. He believed, that not one in into all the measures of the noble marquis's 20 members had read the papers, and if administration,
this was the case, it was a sufficient reply Mr. Halá thought that if the house had to all that had been said on the opposite any sense of national justice, or any re side. He allowed that marquis Wellesley gard for its own character, it would not was a man of high rank, of considerable suffer any further delay to retard its final talents, and that his conduct had been decision upon this question.
arraigned; but none of these circumstanMr. S. L. Lushington asserted that already ces was sufficient to counterbalance the British India had to lament the measures material consideration of the incapacity which had lately been adopted in this of the tribunal in its present state of incountry. The charge in the present in- formation, to pass a decision upon the stance he maintained was personal, and charges which had been brought against therefore ought to be decided without him. The accusations which had been further delay.
lodged against him were what were inci· Lord A. Hamilton was of- opinion, that dent to the lot of every great man. They as gentlemen were not very forward to were taxes wbich greatness and distinction encounter the obloquy of taking up such had to pay, nor was the noble marquis so charges, and the noble lord had under- destitute of friends, or so run down in the taken this with such laudable attention, world, that they bore upon him with any the business ought not to be taken out of peculiar degree of weight. On the conhis hands. If his hon. friend should here- trary, if his conduct was arraigned it after propose a committee to inquire into ought to be recollected that it was in the the transactions in the Carnatic, or at Fur- nature of that conduct to beget friends. ruckabad, he would be ready to support He denied that there had been any unhim; but in the present instance he thought necessary delay. It was not fair in calcuthe course proposed by his noble friend lating this to count the number of parliashould not be rejected.
ments since the subject was first intro- Mr. Grant would have supported the duced to notice, for the present parliament motion for a committee, if that had been was not supposed to be acquainted with originally proposed; but as the noble lord the proceedings which had been instituted had taken up the question with a view to by any preceding parliament. And when
the period during which the present dis- | papers in their present state, would read cussions had been pending was considered, them after they were arranged, or that it certainly did not afford any reason for they would read the report, which would such a complaint, when it was compared probably be still more voluminous than with the time that was occupied with the the papers ? prosecution either of Mr. Hastings or lord Sir T. Turton exhorted the house not to Clive. But even supposing that there had hurry a proceeding of such great importbeen more delay than was necessary, this ance. This was not a case in which a was no reason why the house ought to pass private person alone was interested. It a premature and precipitate decision. It affected the rights of a whole people, who might be said, to be sure, that members had no tribunal but that house to whom to might have carried the papers to the apply for justice. They had no friend country with them during the recess, but but that house, and if it slighted the appeal since parliament met there had been such now made, it forfeited its own character a press of other business as completely to and honour, and the character and honour occupy their time. But even if they were of the country. At all events, he trusted chargeable with remissness, that was no it was not meant to proceed to the consireason why they should now pass a judg. deration of the question to-night. ment for which they were totally unpre Sir S. Romilly admitted that justice to pared. In such circumstances, an acquit- the noble marquis required that no unnetal would be no acquittal, and condemna- cessary delay should take place. Justice, tion would be no more than condemnation. however, could not be done to him, and, He had made himself so far master of the what was of still higher importance, to the subject as to have formed an opinion very national character, if the house came to a unfavourable certainly to many parts of premature decision. A great deal had the noble marquis's administration, but been said of the number of parliaments what he wished was, that some farther de- which had passed since the papers were lay should be granted to those who had laid on the table ; let it, however, be renot made themselves masters of the sub- collected, that there were many members ject. He concluded with deprecating a in that house who had sat there for not hasty decision upon a question in which more than seven months, not one of whom, the national character was most deeply of course, had heard a single word on the involved. Were the house, by a vote this subject of these papers, which could enable evening, to give its sanction to all the fla- thein to form any idea as to the facts which gitious outrages which had been commit- they were meant to substantiate ; and yet ted in India against the rights of indepen they were now called on to give a decision dent princes, in violation of all the princi- on evidence of which they did not know ples of justice, honour, and good faith, he the bearing. This was said to be a queswas afraid that, in the estimation of the tion personal to the noble marquis, but world, this country would stand chargea- still it was no less a judicial question, and ble with many of those crimes which we he had never yet heard of any proceeding had reprobated so much in others, but of by which a fair result of such a question which we had in several recent instances, could be obtained, unless those who were he was afraid, been too successful imita- to judge of it, were previously acquainted tors.
with the facts charged, and the nature of Mr. B. Bathurst said, that if the house the defence. Was there a man in that was unprepared to decide upon the ques- house prepared at the present moment to tion now, this want of preparation might say, that he was ready to come to a right be a good reason for adjourning the debate decision on the case ?" He had, with great to some future day, but it did not appear inconvenience to himself, gone through a to him that it furnished ground for insti- considerable part of these papers, and if tuting a new proceeding. In proposing to obliged to come to his decision this night, appoint a select committee one or two he must give it against the noble marquis, objects must be in view, either that this though he did not say, that in the mass of committee should merely form an index to evidence before the house, there might not the papers, or that it should enter into an be evidence in the noble marquis’s favour of investigation of the whole affairs of India, which he was at present ignorant. He was and report thereupon to the house. But, of opinion, that to send the evidence to a in either case, what security had they that committee to return a digested report of those gentlemen who had not read the it to the house, would be the only means VOL. X.
HOUSE OF COMMONS.
of arriving at substantial justice. None, amendment to be withdrawn, in order to he was convinced, ought to desire this so allow the house to decide, whether it would anxiously as the friends of the marquis, proceed in a house, or refer the case to a and nothing could be more unsatisfactory committee. When that question should than a premature decision.
be decided, the proper time for proceeding Sir A. Wellesley.said, it was for the house might be considered; and he was of opito decide what mode of proceeding would nion, that to-morrow would be preferable best suit its own convenience and the ends to to-morrow se'nnight. It was a vacant of justice; but, he contended, that it had day, and it was agreed that it was desirbeen always asked, and it was the only able to hear the noble lord's charges stated thing that was asked, on the part of the as soon as possible. noble marquis, that the case should be Sir F. Burdett withdrew bis amendment brought to as speedy a decision, as a re- for deferring the further proceeding to togard to justice and fair inquiry would morrow se'nnight. allow. The propriety of this principle Lord Folkestone was ready, for his own had been laid down and enforced by the part, to proceed to-morrow; but he underbighest authority on all sides of the house, stood the gentlemen about him preferred and among others, by an hon. gent, now to-morrow se'nnight. A division was then no more (Nr. Fox), whose opinion would called for, when there appeared, For the weigh very much with the gentlemen on orginal motion, 21. For referring the the other side. He did not suppose that bussine-s to a committee 94.—While the every member had read the papers word gallery was shut a conversation took place for word: but he was satisfied there were about the proper time of taking the subvery few who had not read them suffici- ject into consideration again, when it was ently to enable them to give a conscien- agreed to make the order for to-morrow tious vote. All that he asked now, was se'nnight. what he had asked before, as speedy a de+ cision as the house in its sense of justice could adınit. Lord Folkesione, thought the house was
Tueslay, February 23. sufficiently in possession, at least of the Petitioy FROM OLDHAM RESPECTING main facts of the case, to come to a deci- | PcACE.] Col. Stanley presented a Petision on the Oude question at once, with- tion from the inhabitants of Oldham and its out going into the general policy of the neighbourhood, in the county Palatine of system of government in India, which he Lancaster, setting forth, “That the petithought belonged more properly to the tioners experience great inconvenience general consideration of the Finances of from a considerable depression of their India, of which the right hon. gent. op- trade, a depression which causes a reposite (Mr. Dundas) had given notice, or duction in the wages of labour unprecethe other general view of that part of the dented in the most afflicting times hereempire to be brought forward by the hon. tofore known, and which renders it difgent. below him (Mr. Creevey). It was ficult for the most industrious and healthy their own fault if any gentlemen were workman to procure for himself and family unprepared to come to the decision. the bare necessaries of life; that the manu
Sir. F. Burdett thought it impossible to facturer is unable to afford him any lasting decide this night upon the merits of the relief, for, even with this reduced state of case, when the minds of gentlemen were wages, he cannot find a market for his not made up as to the proper form of pro- goods that will return him a profit adequate .ceeding. He moved as an amendment to to his expences and risks; that in the train the motion, the insertion of the words of these distresses follow the increase of “ to-morrow se'nnight," instead of the the poor rates, the numerous assignments, word “ now.”
bankruptcies, and all the various acts Lord Folkestone agreed in the impos- whereby the property of others becomes sibility of going into the merits of the injured and insecure ; that the petitioners case at so late an hour this night. He are persuaded, that the ultimate cause of was ready to agree in the hon. baronet's most of the evils here complained of is the motion, if the house thought fit.
war in which we are unfortunately engaged, The Chancellor of the Erchequer allowed, which has been prolonged to an unusual that it was impossible to go into the merits length, and which the powers of the conof the case this miglit. He wished the tinent alledge we intend to male perpetual,